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Ouch!

11 Apr

A Flynnian Mystery & Quiz Involving the Following Stars.

Who and What Else were Involved??

shelley book

Cary Grant

Flynn Shirtless

Yvonne 2

Clark Gable

Mulholland Farm

— Tim

 

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  1. Gentleman Tim

    April 11, 2016 at 7:03 am

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  2. shangheinz

    April 11, 2016 at 9:29 am

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    Couch! Sorry for spoilering. Clark Gable and Errol Flynn went out on a double (bed) date with Shelley Winters and Yvonne DeCarlo, which ended under a full mirror at Mullholland Farm. But I am not saying who went with who…

     
    • Gentleman Tim

      April 11, 2016 at 10:04 am

      very good, mirrorheinz. You’re looking in the right direction, but there is a slight misspoilering in your answer and further reflection is needed. Though the extraorinary answer is quite astonishingly mysterious and very rarely ever seen, it is not to be found through the looking glass. It is even more curiouser than your House with Gable answer.

      This character is here/was there to help:

      doctor-house-call.jpg

       
  3. rswilltell

    April 11, 2016 at 1:26 pm

    Film star Yvonne De Carlo wrote in her own book ‘Yvonne: An Autobiography’ (1987) with Doug Warren that Shelley Winters lied through her teeth in her book ‘Shelley’. Ms. De Carlo stated in no uncertain terms that the incident between her, Errol Flynn, Clark Gable, and the never demure Shelley Winters was completely false and fabricated to sell her book. Yvonne De Carlo said that she didn’t meet Clark Gable until years later when she co-starred with him in ‘Band Of Angels’ (1957). She also said that she never actually met Errol Flynn let alone go to bed with him at his Mulholland Castle. She said Gable was a perfect gentleman when they made the film. Ralph Schiller

     
    • Gentleman Tim

      April 11, 2016 at 2:00 pm

      Thank you for that great input, Ralph. I, of course, have no personal knowledge of the events alleged by S.W. Her account could well be completely false. In fact, for the record, Shirley was regarded locally as a notorious troublemaking loudmouth in my old neighborhood of Brooklyn long before her days in Hollywood. A real slut. … So you won’t catch me defending her.

      That said, though, she did have a skill of getting men into bed and otherwise involved with her, including Flynn (and Tony Franciosa, a non-graduate alumni of my small college in New York City.) And, though almost always out of school, not all she says is untrue. I think she made a superbly-menacing Ma Barker, too. (Plus, didn’t she very bravely save a lot of people on the Poseidon? That’s gotta count for something.)

      The mystery I’m referring to in this quasi-quiz, actually has little to do with Gable or DeCarlo. They are peripheral and non-essential to the quiz answer – which, by the way, even Chilly Winters concedes she did not know, but I believe I have found the answer to through another source, allegedly related to the other star pictured above.

       
      • rswilltell

        April 11, 2016 at 3:05 pm

        Hey Tim; I have no idea which of these ladies is telling the truth on this incident although I lean towards Yvonne de Carlo. She was pretty outraged in print towards Shelley. Ms. Winters was a great actress with two Oscars to her credit ‘Diary Of Anne Frank’ (1959) and for ‘A Patch Of Blue’ (1965) but also deserved to win Oscars for her unforgettable work in both ‘A Place In The Sun’ (1951) and ‘Lolita’ (1962). Can you imagine how stormy her marriages were to the always mercurial Anthony Franciosa and the hot-tempered Italian star Vittorio Gassman? I remember her on a ‘Merv Griffin’ talk show in 1972 plugging the big disaster movie. She was talking about how nice it was to make the film, and fellow guest Joe Flynn turned on the air into Captain Binghamton and sneered at her, “I talked to my pal Ernie Borgnine and he told me that you were absolutely rotten to work with! Rotten!” Without batting an eye Shelley said “That’s true!”. Griffin laughed and quickly called for a commercial break! I look forward to you clearing up the quiz. Ralph Schiller

         
        • Gentleman Tim

          April 11, 2016 at 3:54 pm

          You really know your Hollywood history, Ralph! I’m out of my league, but love learning these things from you.

          Btw, one for you and shang, did Shelley show up, or threaten to show up during the shooting of William Tell?

           
          • rswilltell

            April 11, 2016 at 7:37 pm

            Tim; This would be news to me. Maybe Heinz can answer it. Ralph Schiller

             
          • shangheinz

            April 13, 2016 at 7:08 pm

            Did she say so!? I would be shelleyshocked if that was true, since I never even heard about it. Just as true as the rumour that Hildegarde Neff and Ulla Jacobsson had been considered by Errol for the female part of Mrs. Tell.

             
            • Gentleman Tim

              April 13, 2016 at 7:45 pm

              My recollection re this could well be in error, euroheinz. It stems from my reading what reads like reams of hand-written Errolian literature several sunny days in sunny South Florida earlier this year.

              Those letters are not available to me again until tomorrow night and may take some hours to re-read. Though I surely do not want to shirley-shock you, haasschlossshlonbrunnheinz, I will search to see from where this possibly erroneous Errolian notion evolved.

              Perchance it was another time or locale involved. If I had some monkey glands handy, I’d likely recall much better.

              Time Will Tell.

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              • shangheinz

                April 13, 2016 at 9:07 pm

                Can’t wait to read your recollections Glandleman Tim! That quiz shirley put us to the test(icle).

                 
                • rswilltell

                  April 14, 2016 at 12:41 pm

                  Tim and Heinz! Please follow up on this. So little is known about the making of William Tell! We all forget based on the blowsy, bloated-looking Shelley Winters of the 1970’s and 1980’s, that she was a stunning looking glamour doll in the 1940’s and 1950’s. The photo above confirms that or better yet watch her with James Stewart and Dan Duryea in ‘Winchester ’73’ (1950) Ralph Schiller

                   
                  • Gentleman Tim

                    April 14, 2016 at 11:12 pm

                    My mistake, Ralph & Shang. I just reread Errol’s handwritten letters to Nora from Italy. Though the (undated) letter mentioning “Shirley” causing problems follows a letter discussing William Tell, I now realize it is out of order. I know this because the letter following the William Tell letter indicates that both Freddie McEvoy and Stephen Raphael’s wives are pregnant (and that Freddie & his wife were going to sail their “hot yacht” “from Gibralter to Nassau”.) I believe this puts “Shirley’s” visit (~’51) too early to be during filming of William Tell.

                    Moreover, it’s not clear if the Shirley refers to is Shirley Winters, or another Shirley. The visit appears to have been to Cinicitta Studios.

                     
  4. Gentleman Tim

    April 11, 2016 at 2:10 pm

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    • timerider

      April 11, 2016 at 3:34 pm

      Gadzook! Marx brothers bring back my childhood sitting in the seats under the balcony of the Century theater with a million kids flying paper airplanes, spitballs and the occasional rain of popcorn! LOL… As for Mr Gable, my friends in NM sent me photos of two of his young relatives that look so much like him.The young man could be his twin at a very young age.The young women really has Clark’s charisma but hopefully not his ears…LOL!

       
      • Gentleman Tim

        April 11, 2016 at 4:01 pm

        Are you the guy that hit me with that spitball during Horsefeathers, timerider?

        Yeah, I hear ya’, Clark had a couple of gables for ears.

        Irving Berlin gave the Marxes the lyric that connects to this mystery quiz.

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  5. Gentleman Tim

    April 11, 2016 at 5:16 pm

    Please remember, I cannot say whether Chilly Winters is telling the truth or not in this story of hers, but there is one part of it that would seem very odd for her to completely make up. Even she claims not to know what she saw, though I believe I MAY have found the answer – unless we’re dealing with yet another, apparently independent Hollywood liar (nor at all impossible, of course, particularly in tale-telling Tinsel Town.)

    follow me to Shangri-La

     
    • Tina

      April 11, 2016 at 10:22 pm

      Tim, was Chico Errol’s ape involved?

      Here are the lyrics but can’t make sense of it.
      IRVING BERLIN
      “The Monkey Doodle Doo!”
      [Verse:]
      Monkeys upon a tree never are very blue
      They never seem to be under par that is true
      Not like the ones you see on a bar in the zoo
      Monkeys upon a tree do the Monkey Doodle Doo
      [Refrain:]
      Oh, among the mangoes where the monkey gang goes
      You can see them do
      The little Monkey Doodle Doo
      Oh, a little monkey playing on his one key
      Gives them all the cue
      To do the Monkey Doodle Doo
      Let me take you by the hand
      Over to the jungle band
      If you’re too old for dancing
      Get yourself a monkey gland
      And then let’s
      Go, my little dearie, there’s the Darwin theory
      Telling me and you
      To do the Monkey Doodle Doo

       
      • Gentleman Tim

        April 11, 2016 at 10:50 pm

        I sincerely hope not, Tina. If he was, he would have surely and rightfully rocked the Hills of Hollywood with even more piercing soprano shrieks than usual. … Perhaps, though, one of his distant cousins had a small part there. Depends on what the doctor had in his black bag that night, I suppose. (If Winter’s Tale is true.)

         
      • Gentleman Tim

        April 12, 2016 at 1:49 pm

        Yes, Tina, I. B.’s lyrics actually include the alleged answer to this mystery quiz.

         
  6. Gentleman Tim

    April 11, 2016 at 10:58 pm

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  7. Gentleman Tim

    April 12, 2016 at 5:34 pm

     
  8. Gentleman Tim

    April 12, 2016 at 5:40 pm

     
  9. Gentleman Tim

    April 13, 2016 at 12:21 am

    “Before my father became a tool of the fabulous Las Vegas Mafia, paid like Frank Sinatra & Dino to lure high stakes suckers to Vegas with his dark timbre, he had to make his money the old fashioned way — by being the tool of drug companies and entrepreneurial doctors, many of whom had found themselves out of work after the collapse of Nazi Germany. Papa and Cary Grant were both early advocates of the mental health benefits of LSD. Papa introduced Errol Flynn to novel & experimental kinds of aphrodisiac — a tiny cut was made and then pills & monkey glands were inserted under the skin in some discrete place, such as the shoulder blade – ”

    Louis B. Mayer has also been said to have been a big proponent of monkey glands for select, low-testosterone MGMers.

    Apparently popular with some Hollywood elites.

    Possibly Houdini, too.

    And some athletes:
    books.google.com…

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